Keith 737 mip

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jph
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Re: Keith 737 mip

#61 Post by jph »

As per the type of panels used on cockpitsimparts, these will work fine I believe. You can check measurements from datasheets with your panels mate. Based on CSP measurements. As a point of interest, opencockpits panels are heavily botched and not to scale at all. I was pretty shocked at that. I think all measurments need a base to work from and CSP is the best me thinks. If you have another preferred base measurement source let me know. CSP are VERY true to RL though.
CSP panel measurements -
737 MIP CSP 1.jpg
Ok, update to the monitors for the Main Instrument Panel, with examples of each type. I have listed the datasheets which show the actual panel size AND the actual active display area so you can measure against the physical AND visual space.
These are just examples. They are all latest spec LED Backlit IPS 1080p (1920 x 1080) 30 pin eDP panels. All can use exactly the same type of driver board and single 12V supply at around 2A maximum per panel. All could be powered from a single Meanwell 12V power unit.
All are HDMI input. As they are 1080p they can be driven from any displayport output using a simple and cheap HDMI adapter. They can also be driven from a 10 euro USB to HDMI adapter.
The IPAD screen driver unit is HDMI but MUST be driven from HDMI 2.0 or later as it is 2048 x 1536.

There are different types of display available with different refresh rates. They all basically perform the same if they are of the same spec. 60hz refresh is plenty.
ANY 17.3" Panel that is IPS with 1920 x 1080 resolution and an industry standard eDP 30 pin connector will work, the numbers in the datasheets are purely for reference and measurements.

MIP Dual DU Captain and FO panels are 17.3" FULL HD 16:9 aspect laptop screen. IPS and also 30pin eDP standard.
17.3 FHD IPS NT140WHM.pdf
(1.28 MiB) Downloaded 190 times

The Centre EICAS is a 14" FULL HD 16:9" aspect laptop screen. IPS and also 30pin eDP standard.
N140HCA-EAB-INNOLUX.pdf
(1.28 MiB) Downloaded 199 times

Driver board(s) for the above
eDP 30 pin Full HD 1920 x 1080 (1080p)
https://www.aliexpress.com/item/4001242 ... 1802cyZycZ


The LOWER EICAS has to fit in-between the two FMC units so is a bit of a bastard size. This one will work fine. A 14" the same as the Centre EICAS above would work and fill the space but allowance would need to be made in the throttle quadrant area to allow 7cm if the monitor to be located.
Ipad display lower EICAS
https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005001 ... 1802cyZycZ
driver for IPAD display
https://www.aliexpress.com/item/3276519 ... 1802cyZycZ


Edit..type screen res corrected
Last edited by jph on Mon Jun 20, 2022 8:00 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Joe. CISSP, MSc.

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Keith Baxter
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Re: Keith 737 mip

#62 Post by Keith Baxter »

Hi,

Just for interest sake DU6 is not the same height as the FMC's. Also it is rotated 180°
This image from the FCOM
ice_screenshot_20220601-154848.png

My FMC are W:146 H: 220


Keith
AMD RYZEN 9 5950X CPU, Corsair H80I cooler, ASUS TUF GAMING B550-PLUS AMD Ryzen Mother Board,  32Gb ram Corsair Vengeance 3000Mh, MSI GTX960 4G graphics card 

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jph
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Re: Keith 737 mip

#63 Post by jph »

Yeah, Height has never been an issue on that runt of a place ;) , it is width. To get something wide enough to 'fill' the visual area would mean it was too 'long' bottom to top, for the space due to aspect ratio. This is why they all use the 9.7 cheap tv screen and rotate it 90 degrees to fit the space which is the worst possible thing you can do to a TN panel as the view angles from above and below are horrendously bad. Just like any TN laptop screen - if you look directly at the screen with the screen in the correct visual plane it is ok, if you tilt the screen back, or forewords, the view rapidly fades Dark Negative and Light Washout respectively, and within 10 degrees or so. There is no position in the aircraft that the image is actually correct and only 1 pilot will ever be able to read it, and then badly.

This is why IPS is needed. The visual angles are NOT altered in this way at all.

It is the same for any of the other NON IPS panels. The Left seat cannot see the right seat screens without severe wash out and Jimi Hendrix effect.
TN panels are fine if you are looking directly at the screen in the correct orientation plane and alignment. If not, they are pants.

Luckily the lower EICAS displays tend to be narrower (the graphics) so the fact that the screen doesn't fill the width completely is not an issue. Also, this screen, the IPAD, is exactly the same size as the ones that most people use. (the '10") TV one at 4:3 aspect - which is actually 9.7, and is therefore exactly the same size as the IPAD but the IPAD screen is massively better resolution and also it is IPS so no viewing angle issues.
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Re: Keith 737 mip

#64 Post by jph »

Some people have used a monitor that also display the FMC screens, and this is certainly possible. The difficulty with this is getting the actually FMC unit to be 'thin' enough to have the keypad / PCB / illumination / facia etc fit over the LCD panel. If that is possible with yours then you can use a single monitor for the 2 x FMC and also the Lower EICAS.
Joe
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Keith Baxter
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Re: Keith 737 mip

#65 Post by Keith Baxter »

Hi,

Well I already have the displays for the FMC so I will just have to find a screen for the DU. ;)
That frame is the one i printed.
c mip.jpg

Keith
AMD RYZEN 9 5950X CPU, Corsair H80I cooler, ASUS TUF GAMING B550-PLUS AMD Ryzen Mother Board,  32Gb ram Corsair Vengeance 3000Mh, MSI GTX960 4G graphics card 

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Re: Keith 737 mip

#66 Post by jph »

Nice one :D
Yes, I have those screens, yours are the ZJ050NA-08C 640x480 I presume ?
They are really nice screens. Quite amazing for TN. People often see 640 x 480 and think pah ! low resolution, but at that size they are actually a VERY nice resolution. It is all relative. They are an exception to a rule in the viewing angles as they were originally POS units (Point of Sale - Cash registers for supermarkets etc) so have very well designed filters on the front and very good side viewing angles. :shock:
It is one of those that I tested my dimming modification by intercepting the direct PWM of the backlight via Arduino. Works great.!
I was also playing with one of these yesterday - on that very screen -
1080P-USB-3-0-to-HDMI-Compatible-Converter-Multi-Display-Graphic-Adapter-for-PC-Laptop-Projector.jpg_Q90.jpg
https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005003 ... 1802AanZ1S

VERY NICE !- ridiculously cheap price. I have ordered 4 more to test the performance hit on a low end PC. Quality is spot on. I was prepared to throw the converter in the bin if it was crap but it was like - err wow !. ;)

As for the centre lower EICAS, yeah, they all seem to use the 9.7" - such as - https://www.aliexpress.com/item/4000525 ... 7655%21sea (this is the same screen as in the unit listed on opencockpits)

It is low res and outdated, and non IPS (TN).
The IPAD is exactly the same dimensions and is the same damn price with driver board.

Have you played much with the 5" units ?,, really cool.
Joe
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jph
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Re: Keith 737 mip

#67 Post by jph »

Hey Keith,
Here's a little tool I have been using that I knocked up in Excel.
If you know the resolution and the ACTUAL screen diagonal it will calculate the horizontal and vertical visual area and PPI. It is accurate to around 0.5 mm
737 monitor dimensions calculator.xlsx
(12.28 KiB) Downloaded 165 times
Monitor calc - Joe.jpg
It's had a LOT of use :lol:

You can view 4 different units at a time. If you find it useful or want any changes let me know.
Joe
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Keith Baxter
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Re: Keith 737 mip

#68 Post by Keith Baxter »

Hi,

The Glare-shield went in about a week and a half ago.
I must say that working with the PVC board was painless and quick.
mip9.jpg
Keith
AMD RYZEN 9 5950X CPU, Corsair H80I cooler, ASUS TUF GAMING B550-PLUS AMD Ryzen Mother Board,  32Gb ram Corsair Vengeance 3000Mh, MSI GTX960 4G graphics card 

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jph
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Re: Keith 737 mip

#69 Post by jph »

Looking good !>

Have you a link to the type of board to which you refer ? . It is not one i am familiar with.
Thanks
Joe
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Keith Baxter
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Re: Keith 737 mip

#70 Post by Keith Baxter »

jph wrote: Wed Jun 22, 2022 3:24 pm Looking good !>

Have you a link to the type of board to which you refer ? . It is not one i am familiar with.
Thanks
Joe
Joe,

I used 40% foam PVC board. It is used in the lighting display and signage industry. There are many sources and google is your friend finding a source nearest you.
The board comes in different density and is very strong but rather soft on lower densities.
It can be laminated between aluminium to provide strength to weight ratio.

Cockpit builders have turned to this medium because it is easy to work with, light, strong, machines very well for engraving and very reasonably priced. It is also good for back-lighting as light passes through it better than acrylic and other plastics.


Keith
AMD RYZEN 9 5950X CPU, Corsair H80I cooler, ASUS TUF GAMING B550-PLUS AMD Ryzen Mother Board,  32Gb ram Corsair Vengeance 3000Mh, MSI GTX960 4G graphics card 

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