AM 4.0 Crashes on "Show" !!!

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Roxus
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Re: AM 4.0 Crashes on "Show" !!!

#21 Post by Roxus »

Roxus wrote: Thu Jun 03, 2021 4:20 pm and I've been a software developer for more than 30 years
Tho I've worked on Linux almost all my (software) life, and dont have to deal with this bullshit ;)

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jph
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Re: AM 4.0 Crashes on "Show" !!!

#22 Post by jph »

Roxus wrote: Thu Jun 03, 2021 4:20 pm
Its a Windows7 laptop from about 2014 I'm gonna say ? ... let me check ... first released in Dec 2012, so I prolly got it in 2013

The last released of DirectX11 was 2015, that same time they released the last version of the HD3000 drivers.
So when they released the drivers, it presumably had this problem (since nothing has been updated for Windows7 or the drivers since then) and AM4 is making use of some function/ability that they didnt code for properly under DX11. Thats Intels fault, pure and simple (and I've been a software developer for more than 30 years).
Hi Roxus, Just to point you in the right direction.
The Driver in question never supported DX11. It never said it supported DX11. It never 'hinted' at supporting DX11. It actually clearly states 10.1. Hence it was at 10.1 at EOL. DX11 doesn't come into play here for this driver / gpu.
If it helps you, then here are the release notes. It can be clearly seen in the 'hardware' section as to the DX version support at EOL (which was the release in question). ie: DX10.1
https://downloadmirror.intel.com/24970/ ... 4.4229.pdf
So - again, as I said before, it is not 'Intels fault, pure and simple' as you keep saying.
Hope that makes it clearer.

Now, putting DX11 to one side as it does not support it. Then it would be useful to test the drivers abilities under OGL V2.0 / V3.0 - I am unsure if AM requires DX11 OR OGL >= 2.0 on windows. I would expect this means that on Windows, it needs >= to DX11 and >= to OGL 2 on non Windows systems.

However, as said above, I would imagine it is not an option - but I stand to be corrected. I believe it is DX11 min on Windows and OGL is not in play on windows - as there is absolutely no need. On other the minority systems - mac and linux, then it would be OGL.


Joe
Joe. CISSP, MSc.

Roxus
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Re: AM 4.0 Crashes on "Show" !!!

#23 Post by Roxus »

So there it is Ralph, although DX11 Installs and runs, these video cards only support a subset.

I looked in the SDK and you can check feature level (and Dxdiag reports 10.1 for the HD3000 on this laptop) and notify the user that :

"yes, you have DX11 installed, but your GPU doesnt fully suppiort DX11, so youre on your own if shit goes south",

but personally, I wouldnt bother, we are talking a minority of complaints identified, witha subset of very old GPUs. But I guess thats up to you and your team on what sort of customer support level you want to provide.

Roxus
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Re: AM 4.0 Crashes on "Show" !!!

#24 Post by Roxus »

So anyway, this laptop is gping back on the junkpile again, where it was found ...

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jph
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Re: AM 4.0 Crashes on "Show" !!!

#25 Post by jph »

Roxus wrote: Fri Jun 04, 2021 10:02 am So there it is Ralph, although DX11 Installs and runs, these video cards only support a subset.

I looked in the SDK and you can check feature level (and Dxdiag reports 10.1 for the HD3000 on this laptop) and notify the user that :

"yes, you have DX11 installed, but your GPU doesnt fully suppiort DX11, so youre on your own if shit goes south",

but personally, I wouldnt bother, we are talking a minority of complaints identified, witha subset of very old GPUs. But I guess thats up to you and your team on what sort of customer support level you want to provide.
Roxus, Please take a step back for a moment and chill.
It is nothing to do with what you have 'installed' it is what is supported by your system. IF you have been programming for 30 years you should know this. There is no excuse.
You may well have DX11 'installed' , but as you say, DXDIAG properly reports the support of your hardware as DX10.1. Which is correct and is exactly the same as intel's information. Many drivers 'install' but do not mean that they bring your old EOL hardware up to the latest version that the driver offers. The drivers offer backward compatibility in most cases - NOT !!! forward compatibility. :roll:
There is no need to specify #if you have dx 11 installed'# - it is down to 'SUPPORT of DX11'
The information is clear - "Video card: Supports OpenGL 2.0 or higher, or supports DirectX 11 or higher"
NOT - what you have supposedly 'installed'
It clearly states that your "video card" supports "DirectX 11 or higher" :shock: - and yours does not.
There is nothing else needed to clarify.

to say to Sim Inno and AM team - "But I guess thats up to you and your team on what sort of customer support level you want to provide."
Is, - imho - insulting to the superb work they do.
They CLEARLY state the requirements. You now confirm - after having it pointed out to you - that your system does NOT meet these requirements.
Joe. CISSP, MSc.

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jph
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Re: AM 4.0 Crashes on "Show" !!!

#26 Post by jph »

Roxus wrote: Fri Jun 04, 2021 10:12 am So anyway, this laptop is gping back on the junkpile again, where it was found ...
Hi Roxus
I wouldn't be so quick to junk it :shock: - It may well work with amazing addons such as lilnavmap etc which would be great ! and give it a new lease of life. Also, the LCD screen can be repurposed to an HDMI display using a generic driver board. Loads of uses. If you were in the EU I would be happy to make you an offer.
Joe
Joe. CISSP, MSc.

Roxus
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Re: AM 4.0 Crashes on "Show" !!!

#27 Post by Roxus »

jph wrote: Fri Jun 04, 2021 10:30 am
Roxus, Please take a step back for a moment and chill.

There is no need to specify #if you have dx 11 installed'# - it is down to 'SUPPORT of DX11'
The information is clear - "Video card: Supports OpenGL 2.0 or higher, or supports DirectX 11 or higher"
NOT - what you have supposedly 'installed'
It clearly states that your "video card" supports "DirectX 11 or higher"

to say to Sim Inno and AM team - "But I guess thats up to you and your team on what sort of customer support level you want to provide."
Is, - imho - insulting to the superb work they do.

dude, CTFO yourself!!!

They *could* add

if (dx.VERSION >= 11 && dx.FEATURE_LEVEL < 11) dialog("Sorry, your GPU does not fully support DX11. You may have trouble")

but as I said, *WHY BOTHER* !?!?

I could only find 3 other forum posts related to this problem (one for AM3.4 I think it was) but others AM4BETA when this happened to me. Theyd have to code it, test it, and verify it on HW they might not even have ? And to what end ?

Now, Ralph/Russ knows what the culprit is, and can ask the person asking for help to check their dxdiag for tbe actual FEATURE_LEVEL supported before going down any rabbit holes. Or one day it might be an FAQ for AM4. Ralph said himself, he doesnt know why this was happening. Now the problem has been zeroed.

But *again*, as I said, *WHY BOTHER* !?!?!

The incidence rate is WAY too small IMO to chase. But if he wants to, thats his call, cost benefit analysis and all.

Roxus
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Re: AM 4.0 Crashes on "Show" !!!

#28 Post by Roxus »

Roxus wrote: Fri Jun 04, 2021 12:24 pm They *could* add

if (dx.VERSION >= 11 && dx.FEATURE_LEVEL < 11) dialog("Sorry, your GPU does not fully support DX11. You may have trouble")
BTW, its not THAT simple either, coz I had 3 USB monitors using the DisplayLink GPU chipset as well as the Intel GPU. So youd have to walk an array of video devices to see if theres any that dont comply.

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Ralph
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Re: AM 4.0 Crashes on "Show" !!!

#29 Post by Ralph »

Did you try running Air Manager with OpenGL 2.0 rendering? This can be set in the Settings tab.

Roxus
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Re: AM 4.0 Crashes on "Show" !!!

#30 Post by Roxus »

Ralph wrote: Fri Jun 04, 2021 12:59 pm Did you try running Air Manager with OpenGL 2.0 rendering? This can be set in the Settings tab.
No, I switched to a different PC with a GTX1080 once I found out it was the HD3000 problem and started coding on more instruments I needed

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